http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/06/24/dog.mauling.ap/index.html

Okay, let me get this straight, and anyone here can correct me if I'm wrong.

1) The boy was 12

2) These were family dogs

3) The dogs went ape shit and attacked the kid resulting in his death.

4) The mother is being charged with child endangerment and may face 10 years in prison if convicted.

Alright, last time I checked there isn't anything wrong with leaving a 12 year old home alone while a parent is out running errands. I believe that is perfectly normal and is nothing wrong with that. How would the mother know that the dogs would attack the kid, especially if they were the family dogs. Also I would like to point out that no one knows the situation fully and probably never will. Yeah pit bulls are known to turn against their masters in a heart beat; however this is a 12 year old boy, who knows, maybe he teased or in some other way caused the attack. I see how some boys are with dogs and they can be down right mean and the dog didn't want to take the kid's shit anymore.

The dogs should be terminated, but the mother shouldn't be charged in my opinion. It is not like there is any documented evidence that shows that these attacks has happened in the past with the dogs and it is not as if she purposely left her son home in a dangerous situation knowing that her son could die by a dog attack. Another thing that I would like to mention as well is that I have a dog, Cuddles, german shepard and chow mixed, she wouldn't harm a fly. Never barks, never gets mean, she just walks around quitely and is the nicest thing. I would never expect anything to happen with her attacking someone. Now if I were to leave my brother alone for ten minutes and come back to see something like this would be a shock for me to believe.

In other words I don't think the mother is completely at fault here. I would also like to say that they should just make it illegal in the U.S. for people to own/breed pit bulls, I know some cities and towns are doing it more and more (banning them that is), because it seems to be an ongoing problem with pitbulls attacking people for no reason. Its in their blood and they have gone through years of pit fighting and abuse and it is somehow passing from one generation to the next.

Well who the hell gets a litter of pit bulls as a family pet?! The mother shouldn't be convicted because her pets went insane, but it's still pointless to buy pit bulls

I think the same thing as well. I know for certain I will never own/allow a pit bull in my household let alone my property. If the neighbor gets one, I'm getting a gun, plain and simple.

You are right about not knowing the full story, Pit Bulls are aggressive by nature, and when choosing a family pet especially when you have small children A Pitt Bull should not be one of them.

With regards to the charge, this woman has suffered one of the worst things that could happen to a parent, losing a child. Putting her in jail is not the right answer. Its seems to me there has been a break down in the whole community, the education, the amount of information available about Pitt Bulls and there temperament. I don't think the dog is to blame here either because they are a product of man. Pitt Bulls should come with a warning and some type of special licence that spells out the consequences of these types of situations. Her consequences for this situation are that she lost her child and because I don't think the law adequately addresses these occurrences, she should be given some sort of probation that requires that she help educate others about the dangers of owning a Pitt Bull.

Well duh! Okay... (show of hands) ...Who likes to be interupted when they're screwing?!?

This is a stupid people issue and not the dog's fault.

You got that right.

I'm not a pit bull hater, in fact I like them and know people that have them. One friend had his stolen, it appears people in the area steal them for dog fights.

Educating people about pit bulls is not the answer because they already know. They get pit bulls for their reputation. They want to say "look I have a pit bull as a pet". They are not acquired for children's pets. I don't give a damn what anyone says people get them for their reputation as an asskicker, period. If they wanted a cuddly childrens pet they would get a fricken beagle or something. Dogs are animals and I don't care if it makes you breakfast in the morning certain breeds are more prone to violence in certain situations. Adults should be able to think for themselves without having the government pass laws to protect them. This woman is an adult and she knew the hazards of owning something like a pit bull and having it around her children, therefore she is liable. I'm getting sick of the "nobody is liable for their own actions, the government has to pass laws to protect them" attitude. Pit laws should not be banned, adults should be required to use proper sense. More people die in bath tubs, should the government outlaw them? There's a lady here that owns a bobcat. It'snot illegal, but it's her responsibliity to make sure it it's under control and in the proper setting. There are plenty of bulls the will kill children also. Should bulls be illegal? No, but they should not be a childrens pet as pit bulls should not be. Should children be around horses unsupervised? No, but that's up to adults to control.

The woman was an adult and chose to provide a breed of dog know to become vicious to her children. It's not the government's responsibility to make sure she is a parent to her children. Let her take responsibility for her actions and serve her time. It's not the dogs fault in any way, shape or form. It's the mother's.

What's next? Since there are peopel too stupid to drive and they cause accidents the government should outlaw cars to protect us? I have seen parrots, like large macaw's that are great peds to the primary humman, but can be agressive sometimes to others. There are probably more injuries due to bird attacks than pit bull, they just don't result in death. Should parrots be outlawed? ADULTS that have these pets should be required to treat and control them responsibly. Adults need to be held responsible for their actions.

Leaving a child with a pit bull when you leave is like leaving a loded gun out with your children when you leave. It should be looked at the same way.

I really hate government intervention, but I could just about agree on a permit (free, just has to be signed for) with the person acknowledging their liability if the dog attacked anyone. It's really not necessary because I have never, ever heard of someone getting a pit bull without knowing how they are. You can't walk into a pet store and get them, you have to be looking for them in particular. people get them for the fact that they have a mean reputation and think it's "cute" their kids playing with them. The sutpid ones anyway, peole with kids should care enough about their kids to get them something else and keep the pit bull locked up.

I don't think the mother should be charged at all. It's really not anyone's fault. Animals are animals, even when I think I have total control over my dog (A Laso Apso/Maltisse mix lol, he's small) he will still bark and run and jump on strangers when they come to the door, yet he will sleep on the edge of my bed with his head resting on my leg at night.

Animals have their own minds and charging the mother for a family pet that decided it wanted to kill something is not right. It's no one's fault but the dogs fault. I mean if there was incidences of this in the past then they should have got rid of the dog in the first place, but if this never happened before (attacks) then there is no way to know this would happen again.

They're deifnately wrong to charge her for this. She's already gone through losing her son, what more punishment is that, it's not even her fault.

And leaving a 12 year old at home is perfectly fine where I live. I came home in grade 6 when I was 12, by myself, was in the house for about 4 hours until my parents/syblings got home.

You are wrong. It's absolutely the mothers fault because she was the only adult involved. It's the dog's fault? Are you for real? It's their nature to do these things and EVERYONE knows this is especially true of pit bulls. How can that be considered their faul?. Dogs get put to sleep for mauling, but it's NEVER the dog's fault because it's ALWAYS negligence on the part of a human that causes it. It's definitely not the childs fault and that leaves the mother because she was the adult that allowed the situation to happen.

Leaving a 12 year old at home is fine that's not the point, leaving a 12 year old alone with a breed of dog know to maul is negligence. I believe tt's like leaving them with a loaded gun as I stated above, but if they shoot themselves it's not the parents fault because they "suffered enough"?. I guess leaving a child alone in a hot car and they die should not be punishable because they "suffered enough"? Both of those instances are punishable, as they should be. I guess if leaving a child alone with a dog known to mnaul and they kill them is not punishable then that would be the perfect way to bump off a child or step child without fear of anything happening. I will not in any way claim this wonam wanted to knock off her child, but it does happen. Anyone that says any different lives in a different world than I do.

Jeez, I guess if I keep a cibra and let it run around and bite someone it's the snakes fault? Things like this are jury trials have become so screwed up. Anyone that would blame an animal for acting natural I would hate to have on my jury, who knows what they would come up with. I have to remember that. If I get in an accident it would have to be the car's fault, it couldn't possibly be the adult that had charge it's fault. There ARE similarities in the issues also, a dog is legally property that has to be controled just as a car is. Looking at it from a legal standpoint she HAS to be guilty of negligence because the dog is considered her property that she is bound by law to control. That means keeping it where it can't do anyone any harm. Let your dog bite someone else and see if the judge finds the dog culpable, not a chance.

That reminds me of a statement I heard in some movie that I believe to be very ture. "Do you really want to be judged by 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty?" or something to that effect.

"Maureen Faibish told the San Francisco Chronicle she had been so concerned about one of the dogs that she shut her son in the basement to protect him. She said the male dog was acting possessively because the female was in heat."



Mom is at fault. She knew and did nothing.

Exactly.

Well after reviewing the posts and reading now the mother's statements, I would have to say that she was at fault. Before I thought that the dog just went completely crazy out of nowhere, but now it seems like the mother knew and has having a problem with this dog. I also think she just went ahead and incriminated herself by telling the media that she had to lock her son in the basement to protect him from that dog.

...sorry, but shes at fault, she knew about it and did nothing to solve it.

100% the truth, it's a deadly weapon, and that is why I say: make pitbulls ILLEGAL!! If you are very cynical, you might say, oh well, it was her own kid, no harm done here (not that the kid had a choice)... But is it fucking normal that parents with children have to cross the street whenever some of these dumb fucks owning a pitbull walk their dog in the street? Because that animal can go bezerk anywhere.

Not to mention that the types that own a pitbull aren't exactly the same people that visit dog schools or train them properly.

To me owning such a dog is like owning a 10 foot python or a lion... Not meant to have in a community with people.

I own an American Staffordshire Bull Terrier and if you've never owned one or did the research pls do not make statements like this

"Yeah pit bulls are known to turn against their masters in a heart beat;"

or

"Pit Bulls are aggressive by nature"

This simply is not true. Dog on dog aggression does not translate into dog on human aggression. This whole situation comes down to the fact that she knew these dogs had iffy temperments and was not a resposible enough owner to get her dog or dogs put down. The neighbours interviewed in this situation said sometimes the dogs were nice sometimes they were not. And leaving any dog alone with a mate in heat is just asking for trouble I dont care what breed it is.

When owning one of these dogs you have to be a responsible owner because when they bite they do more damage then other dogs. The reality of the situation though is these dogs are actually the cause of less bites then Cocker Spanials and Labradors and many other percieved "family dogs" it is just at this point it is trendy for the media to focus on any misdeeds of this breed. Previous breeds that have been persecuted by the media are German Sheperds, Dobermen's and Rotteweilers.

BTW Im not belittling this tragedy I think it was terrible and I feel very sorry for the mother, but I do feel it is her fault. You are responsible for your dogs actions, period. You bring it into the situations, you keep it, you train it and if neccessary you euthanise it.

I'm stating this now and will live and die by this statement. If my Buddie ever shows sign of Human aggression I will be putting him down. No questions, no remorse. And I wold do it with any breed of dog I owned even a frikin Chihuahua. But then again I doubt Buddie will have this issue. I was working on his foot the other night and it was really painful. He was welping and going on. As i've got a cloth in there, mid cry he swings around and licks my face. That my friends is a sign of a solid temperment dog.

This breed gets a lot of shit cause there are a lot of bad owners out there. But dont forget the millions of other people who own this breed, who have children and who trust this animal with there lives. Can they all be wrong, are we all stupid are we all uninformed? If you answer yes I can probably speak and show you research from here until enternity and you will still not believe me because you would rather listen to sensationlistic media.

Next time you see a Pitbull walking down the street dont judge it. Stop and ask to pat and talk with the dog. Then make your judgement.

Sorry for being on a soapbox a bit but I love my dog and I dont want people to judge him out of hand. Part of the responsible owners creed with these dogs is to educate.

G.i.P

PS. Thought I would add a picture or two so you can see my dog.







My parents have had big dogs since I was 8 and they could not hold a candle to how sooky and well tempered Buddie is. Even they say he's a wonderful dog. My mother actually wants Buddie if I can ever not keep him.

nice pics

There's a lady here that has a bobcat for a pet. It's the nicest pet you would ever meet, but it could turn on someone and probably kill them. I like pit bulls and know peopel that own them, but the fact is that they have killed more people than cocker spaniels and labradors and anyone that believes different is fooling themselves. I have never known of anyone stealing cocker spaniels or labradors to use for pit fighting. They do steal pit bulls though because they are much more ferocious when angered.

I have petted many of them thank you and will probably pet many more. One of our good friends just got his son 11 two solid black pit bullpuppies for pets and I do forsee a poteneial problem later on with them and he and his smaller sister. I will stand by what I say about them not being a proper childrens pet. You can leave a loaded weapon out and 100% of the time a child is not going to kill himself with it, but the odds of it are pretty good. Just like all pit bulls will not attack people all of the time, but even the best natured may fool you.

One guy I know that had his pit bull stolen would not let his kids play with him at all. He was big and friendly and I played with him every time I went over there, but he kept him on a chain in the yard because he knew the potential for trouble. The kids, nor were any kids, allowed with him.

G.i.P

Yeah you are right I was mediazed, Its all to do with Bad owners treating there dogs badly, sorry for my stereo typing of the Pitt Bull, I have come to my senses now.

IO agree that it's always the owners fault, some dogs have to be watched/licked up more than others though. I've owned dogs and I guarantee you that a german shepard has to be watched around children more than a toy fox terrier. I've owned both.

I agree as well, German Shepards are good dogs; however you need to keep your eye on them around children. Sometimes things can happen, Lady (god rest her soul) was a good dog, but was a little too rough whenever kids came around.

I base my judgement solely on what the dog is "capable" of doing...

I'm not judging any dog, certainly not yours... And of course your dog can live a lifetime without ever going crazy. But like you say yourself, when your dog show any sign of agression, you will put him down. I just hope for your sake the first sign will not be that the neighbour steps in to tell you his 5 year old is in 20 pieces.

And of course you are correct when you say these dogs aren't agressive by nature... Again, all dogs are capable of going bezerk (certainly in the neighbourhood of kids). I just rather prefer a labrador or a yorkshire terrier going bananas... at least you still have a chance of surviving.

I only wanted to say that "dogs" shouldn't always be considered as pets. You have so many different breeds... Just like "cats" aren't always pets (at least I wouldn't like it when my neighbour comes over to show his newly bought lion).

I couldn't agree more with that. With what has been going on with pit bulls alone, there should be some law that prevents people from owning them as pets or something along those lines; however could it be a slight possibility that maybe pit-bulls are not the only breed of dog that are committing such acts? Could it just be a PR smear by the media, ignoring other type of dog attacks but only focusing on Pit Bulls alone?

Just a thought that I had.

Ok now that we've had our discussion the next question is.

How many of you actually know what a pit-bull looks like and how often do other breeds get called pit-bulls

Find the Pit-bull

Now this guy is playing right down the line. He is only calling the American Pit-Bull Terrier a pit bull. While technically correct there are actually four breeds that tend to be able to be classified as a pit bull.

They are

The American Staffordshire Terrrier - this breed can be registered as an Amer. Pit Bull Terrier due to the loose regulations for conformation on the Pit Bull Breed.

The Staffordshire Terrier. - This is the originating breed for all bull terrier off shoots.

The Bull Terrier - This is the one with the long exagerrated nose.

& Finally

The American Pit-Bull Terrier - This is the one that was bred for the ring. While the other can and have been used for ring fighting, (BTW I do not condone ring fighting but to deny your dogs history is irresponsible).

I agree with many of the statements made above. I would not leave any large dog regardless of breed with unattended children. I would love to see a screening process put in place for potential owners of these dogs, actually any dog. I would also like to see some sort of legislation against breeders who breed dogs with known bad temperments. Yes temperment can be genetic in dogs and there are breeders who will breed strictly for conformation or even worse when dealing with dog fighters dog on dog aggression and not care about whether it is a safe well tempered linage.

Anyway I will not hide the statistics from you. Of all dog related fatalities 25% are caused by pit-bulls. All told 25 seperate breeds have been identified as the cause of human deaths in most studies I have read. It is assumed that the 25% is made up of at least 3 or 4 of the bullie breeds above since I have seen no reference in the statistics to them being seperated out. In the end yes pit-bulls acct for more fatalities then any other breed, at least recently, but in truth my feelings on the situation are this.

1. Pit-bulls and the breeds often lumped in with them do attract owners who want wrist jewelry or the image. Unfortunatly for the breed these are not the type of owners they need.

2. Irresponsible owners and neglect tend to cause dogs to be vicious.


In the end though responsible ownership is the key. A willing ness to work with the dog and train them. To know there limitations and strengths.

Here are some articles you might be interested in. The last one gives the best perspective of them all IMHO.

Tips on Preventing Dog Bites

Dog Bite Stats

Fatal Dog Attacks

Fatal Dog Attacks Statistics

The tragedy of this mauling should have been prevented. Not through banning pitbulls but through education and resposible ownership. I was screened when I purchased my dog because he was a rescue from the SPCA. Buddie also had been screened by the staff there. Breeders should have to do this also and owners of all dogs should have to be licensed similiar to a car license or gun licese. Punish the deed not the breed.

G.i.P

You are correct in that pit bull has grown to a prety large label and often gets appliedto non pit bulls. By far the most common is the american pit bull (terrier), at least places where I have lived. There are lots of them in this area.

I will say again that I believe most pit bull attacks occur not because the owners are ignorant of what they are capable of, but because they don't get them for the right reason in the first place. They get the for the fact they ARE considered that way and they wear them like a badge rather than treat them like they should be treated. They should not be owned to just make the statement "look at me, I own a dog with a reputation:.

I agree whole heartedly with you on that one Major Tom.

Believe me when I say I am not that owner. I see them around and I cringe when I do cause I know they are why I have to defend my dogs rights.

G.i.P

I think what made it worse was when Paris Hilton made it popular, cool, and in fashion to have a live dog as an accessory to style. They even created "doggie bags", purse-like bags where you can put your dog into to carry around.

*sighs*